Honest Review from Steam. Developers Please Read!!

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StoneLegionYT
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Re: Honest Review from Steam. Developers Please Read!!

Post by StoneLegionYT » Mon, 10. Dec 18, 06:57

gschultz wrote:
Mon, 10. Dec 18, 06:52
Kane Hart wrote:
Mon, 10. Dec 18, 06:03
gschultz wrote:
Mon, 10. Dec 18, 05:38

kanes got a popular youtube lets play. i appreciate him being an avid fan like me. but im pretty sure he just trolled me along with 20 other ppl for asking for more communciation. some people dont want to be treated like proper customers.
This is how Egosoft works and it has worked well even oddly though many people dislike Rebirth I actually enjoyed it and the devs kept working on it. Clearly it was not X3 or X4 and never was going to be as the devs stated long before it came out.

The game is being frequently updated, the game is quite awesome and enjoyable and the devs will continue to work on it as well as release minimal 2 DLC's that are more like Expansions compared to what people consider DLC's in the industry now.

As things are going well now I also predict that X4 will last longer then XR as long people are interested and enjoy it over the years. Rebirth was not profitable sadly in the end as no one was willing to give it another chance so more DLC's would of gotten the development team nowhere.

X4 is great and I support their method as long their going to keep working on it. They been doing this forever and guess what once again it works in the end.
a sober response so i appreciate it.

- even if egosoft works this way that means nothing. ive been a customer since x2 and bought everything...even xrebirth vr. this doesn't make me any more than others.....im just saying this you know that i know egosoft. saying that we know they release full priced games that are not finished or broken is really not an argument we should be repeating. i get it, but please it proves nothing really but that we are being normalized. they could have made it a beta. they could have been upfront that core mechanics were turned off or not working. ya see?

- the game is being updated, yes. 1.3 didnt fix the core issues. how about they at least ADMIT to the problems and say we have priority on this and that. not say "you want more war"? which implies that these are design decisions. if these are design decisions and not broken mechnics please save us time and just tell us.

- i bout all xrebirth and dlc and vr offering. what more can i do? how much more can i support? should i keep buying unfinished games without this being explicit and just be happy? you dont see the slipperly slope? lawyers are circling this industry, for good reason. im not saying egosoft deserves it. im saying they need to step up communication to their customers and not leave it up to all of us idiots trying to figure stuff out in the forums. instead of telling noobs about complex mechanics, we are fighting to understand what the heck we are playing.

also thanks for the videos. its always good to have some content to watch in downtime, about one of your favorite IPs. but lets hold them to standards - ethical standards. our standards.
I'm confused here... They did some tweaks that did not quite pan out and then the weekend happen.... They don't need to sit there announcing their every move but show some action and if I was a betting man that will be shown sometime during this week... In fact this issue from the start the devs chimed in. It was not just about create War but rather there was no fighting at all from the AI. From my understanding most their work went into xenon trying to get them working right again and that is not really a war but normal part of the game. Once Xenon come in and take out a few ships and vise versa back and forth around the universe then the economy will start trickling in more due to the fact more resources will be consumed.

Lot of people wanted a more realistic less cheating economy. It's going take time to make it better including finding some decent passive options to eat it up as well outside of food / medical supplies.

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Re: Honest Review from Steam. Developers Please Read!!

Post by gschultz » Mon, 10. Dec 18, 07:21

Kane Hart wrote:
Mon, 10. Dec 18, 06:57
gschultz wrote:
Mon, 10. Dec 18, 06:52
Kane Hart wrote:
Mon, 10. Dec 18, 06:03


This is how Egosoft works and it has worked well even oddly though many people dislike Rebirth I actually enjoyed it and the devs kept working on it. Clearly it was not X3 or X4 and never was going to be as the devs stated long before it came out.

The game is being frequently updated, the game is quite awesome and enjoyable and the devs will continue to work on it as well as release minimal 2 DLC's that are more like Expansions compared to what people consider DLC's in the industry now.

As things are going well now I also predict that X4 will last longer then XR as long people are interested and enjoy it over the years. Rebirth was not profitable sadly in the end as no one was willing to give it another chance so more DLC's would of gotten the development team nowhere.

X4 is great and I support their method as long their going to keep working on it. They been doing this forever and guess what once again it works in the end.
a sober response so i appreciate it.

- even if egosoft works this way that means nothing. ive been a customer since x2 and bought everything...even xrebirth vr. this doesn't make me any more than others.....im just saying this you know that i know egosoft. saying that we know they release full priced games that are not finished or broken is really not an argument we should be repeating. i get it, but please it proves nothing really but that we are being normalized. they could have made it a beta. they could have been upfront that core mechanics were turned off or not working. ya see?

- the game is being updated, yes. 1.3 didnt fix the core issues. how about they at least ADMIT to the problems and say we have priority on this and that. not say "you want more war"? which implies that these are design decisions. if these are design decisions and not broken mechnics please save us time and just tell us.

- i bout all xrebirth and dlc and vr offering. what more can i do? how much more can i support? should i keep buying unfinished games without this being explicit and just be happy? you dont see the slipperly slope? lawyers are circling this industry, for good reason. im not saying egosoft deserves it. im saying they need to step up communication to their customers and not leave it up to all of us idiots trying to figure stuff out in the forums. instead of telling noobs about complex mechanics, we are fighting to understand what the heck we are playing.

also thanks for the videos. its always good to have some content to watch in downtime, about one of your favorite IPs. but lets hold them to standards - ethical standards. our standards.
I'm confused here... They did some tweaks that did not quite pan out and then the weekend happen.... They don't need to sit there announcing their every move but show some action and if I was a betting man that will be shown sometime during this week... In fact this issue from the start the devs chimed in. It was not just about create War but rather there was no fighting at all from the AI. From my understanding most their work went into xenon trying to get them working right again and that is not really a war but normal part of the game. Once Xenon come in and take out a few ships and vise versa back and forth around the universe then the economy will start trickling in more due to the fact more resources will be consumed.

Lot of people wanted a more realistic less cheating economy. It's going take time to make it better including finding some decent passive options to eat it up as well outside of food / medical supplies.
the first weeks communications strategy hasn't worked. yes 1.3 was at the end of last week. im just putting in my two cents so they know that we need to have better communication in the future. some people dont know if we have a bugged game or not. why? because they haven't acknowledged issues clearly and centrally. plus, im not sure why the xenon and khak and therefore the main enemies, are bugged and war is bugged and they didnt feel the need to amend their launch or give us a heads up. sure im being naive, but im only being naive if you ahve accepted that games launch as 1.0s in a beta stage, or in a way hat makes it not a finished product.

what would help is an industry wide standard, that is clear before purchase, that says - you are buying the program as is, and any description of this program is only a description of what we hope the game will become. that is probably not specific enough, but a 1.0 is not a game that has the war and economy problems. why twist ourselves to make that ok? ive done that all last week and previous releases. i hope starting tomorrow we get communication. i care more about proper communication and respecting the obligation to the customer, then working away without talking to us and giving to us whatever they want at the end - this is the slippery slope when we allow companies to advertise what is not there.

to put a finer point on it. 1.3 didnt fix the problems. what is next? communicate, clearly. dont hide it on forums in comments on obtuse threads. we need a clear statement.

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Re: Honest Review from Steam. Developers Please Read!!

Post by StoneLegionYT » Mon, 10. Dec 18, 07:27

Sorry mate this is silly. Seems like you need a personal back rub or something. I'm going wait till the devs get off their weekend and keep pumping updates. They clearly can read the forums they will attempt to put more work into it. Might not be perfect as fixing economy simulated at this level is very complex.

Wish you luck on your back rub.

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Re: Honest Review from Steam. Developers Please Read!!

Post by gschultz » Mon, 10. Dec 18, 07:33

Kane Hart wrote:
Mon, 10. Dec 18, 07:27
Sorry mate this is silly. Seems like you need a personal back rub or something. I'm going wait till the devs get off their weekend and keep pumping updates. They clearly can read the forums they will attempt to put more work into it. Might not be perfect as fixing economy simulated at this level is very complex.

Wish you luck on your back rub.
lol and when they read the forums they will see that people are asking for more communication, and decide whether they can multitask fixing their game AND *GASP* communicating in a central and highlighted way about broken core mechanics. i say and think everything you have. that doesn't mean that we have to shut our eyes. its a bit annoying that you are then pretending like i need a rub. childlish. if you can't see that then i dont know what to say to you. people love getting taken advantage of or treated poorly when they offer their support - they must uphold the contract to the customer, just like i do to mine. and you do to yours. thats why people watch. because you give them what they want and what is advertised. x4

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Re: Honest Review from Steam. Developers Please Read!!

Post by StoneLegionYT » Mon, 10. Dec 18, 08:24

gschultz wrote:
Mon, 10. Dec 18, 07:33
Kane Hart wrote:
Mon, 10. Dec 18, 07:27
Sorry mate this is silly. Seems like you need a personal back rub or something. I'm going wait till the devs get off their weekend and keep pumping updates. They clearly can read the forums they will attempt to put more work into it. Might not be perfect as fixing economy simulated at this level is very complex.

Wish you luck on your back rub.
lol and when they read the forums they will see that people are asking for more communication, and decide whether they can multitask fixing their game AND *GASP* communicating in a central and highlighted way about broken core mechanics. i say and think everything you have. that doesn't mean that we have to shut our eyes. its a bit annoying that you are then pretending like i need a rub. childlish. if you can't see that then i dont know what to say to you. people love getting taken advantage of or treated poorly when they offer their support - they must uphold the contract to the customer, just like i do to mine. and you do to yours. thats why people watch. because you give them what they want and what is advertised. x4
See this what I don't understand contracts, etc. If you have legal issues you should be speaking to a lawyer and not on the official forums if they broken some sort of legal contract in their country. I'm happy with what the devs keeping doing and as long they keep working then their making easily one my fav games of all time. I'm sorry you don't see their hard work via their actions and need them to talk rather then work.

I will always take actions over words.

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Re: Honest Review from Steam. Developers Please Read!!

Post by jeroll3d » Mon, 10. Dec 18, 08:50

CaptainX4 wrote:
Mon, 10. Dec 18, 02:32
jeroll3d wrote:
Mon, 10. Dec 18, 02:23
Simple, dont buy it if you dont like it. If you do, why are you complaining?
are you serious? yeah, I guess you are... well, in more then acceptable cases adverts mislead people, intentionally, and that how big failures they are only comes many hours after purchase. Do you see the future? even reviews and gameplay videos are nothing to make a proper decision and its not accidental that there are NO DEMOS nowadays. it exactly to hide the sad reality. get over it, many people complain and they have every right to complain, it wont be you telling them if they are allowed to do so or not
I talk here, specifically, about prices and the idea they make of games considered 'AAA'. Subjective criterion. However, I reaffirmed that everyone can 'complain', 'ask for something' or suggest something to Egosoft.

I made it a point to make it clear, as bugs were mentioned - that all games of all game companies have bugs, be they and whatever they are.

Finally, I reaffirm, Egosoft always - always - fixes their games and adds free content to them, in addition to possible paid DLCs (which I think is fair).

We are talking about a company that is fighting hard in the gaming market and it is an average company, not a 'mega corporation'. There are workers, people involved in larger projects like DLCs, and these people, just like the company, deserve to get paid for their jobs.
Entusiasta da série X3! The best game.

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Re: Honest Review from Steam. Developers Please Read!!

Post by Perahoky » Mon, 10. Dec 18, 10:11

i think its a bit unfair to pay egosoft less then 50€ while they keep on working, and you get a improved game for 10€ in sale.
If this everyone does, they go under in about 1 year.
thats like i buy a car for 10.000 and a get an upgrade to a lamborghini AND i can take part in freedback and improvement process.
It's Egosoft. Their games are more of an investment than a product, but they always deliver in the end. Unlike other devs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4GQXz3 ... h3F4AaABAg
But at the moment, the game needs improvements, thats true.
Like every x game at the start.

Even X3 was not perfect at the start, it got improved by dozends of updates and mods. And was much more unstable.

EGO_BurnIt said, they have not enough resources for this massive community, they focus in improving and fixing the game instead of waste time in chatting.
"Hope is the last force i have"
"This is how liberty dies, with thounderous applause"
***Modified***

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Re: Honest Review from Steam. Developers Please Read!!

Post by AdrianB1 » Mon, 10. Dec 18, 13:24

palm911 wrote:
Sun, 9. Dec 18, 02:34
people spend more at any mid level restaurant... i thiunk its fairly priced., and will grow, it also means egosoft will ahve the resources to keep expanding, so i am in full agrement with their model!
Please go to your preferred restaurant, tell them to give you something that is a foundation for a meal, not completely cooked, with missing ingredients, with strange taste and come back and tell you are happy with this because they will complete the meal next week and they will get better and better, so in one year time they will get a Michelin star. But pay the full price for this first meal and eat it now, appreciate the potential in it and dream of what the future will be.

Post some pictures or a video after you do it.

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Re: Honest Review from Steam. Developers Please Read!!

Post by ATTACK_HAMSTER » Mon, 10. Dec 18, 14:04

DeJuan wrote:
Sun, 9. Dec 18, 00:49

The Bad:

Massive amounts of bugs in almost every area of the game.
Extremely small map compared to X3 TC and X Rebirth.
Ship variety is lacking in a big way with all factions.
Not many factions which makes the game seem small.
No real enemies to fight and makes the game really boring.
Lack of story line. It is literally just a small sandbox with no clear direction.
Events do not really happen at all. Never been attacked by pirates or anything for that matter.
Lots of Races and Factions are missing altogether. Example: Boron
AI is really really dumb and has no clear purpose in some situations.
Weapons do not work properly and capitol ship shields are weak.
The ship upgrades are cookie cutter. Upgrades are bland and can found everywhere at the exact same prices.
Way to many inactive jump gates.
The UI is missing lots of commands such as making turrents stop firing so your marines can board and not get blown up. Or maybe I just did not see that setting.

Can't help thinking that some of these bad bits will be released as DLC...............
You ain't getting me on no M3 Fool !

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Re: Honest Review from Steam. Developers Please Read!!

Post by palm911 » Mon, 10. Dec 18, 14:21

AdrianB1 wrote:
Mon, 10. Dec 18, 13:24
palm911 wrote:
Sun, 9. Dec 18, 02:34
people spend more at any mid level restaurant... i thiunk its fairly priced., and will grow, it also means egosoft will ahve the resources to keep expanding, so i am in full agrement with their model!
Please go to your preferred restaurant, tell them to give you something that is a foundation for a meal, not completely cooked, with missing ingredients, with strange taste and come back and tell you are happy with this because they will complete the meal next week and they will get better and better, so in one year time they will get a Michelin star. But pay the full price for this first meal and eat it now, appreciate the potential in it and dream of what the future will be.

Post some pictures or a video after you do it.
if you dislike it so much, what are you doing here? you should know how launches has ever been with egosoft, you can decide to support them or not. i can understand people concerns about a developer some people has never heard of, but people who has know how egosoft support their tittle should have some peace of mind. .. just saying
X gamer , one at a time.

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Re: Honest Review from Steam. Developers Please Read!!

Post by CaptainX4 » Mon, 10. Dec 18, 14:35

palm911 wrote:
Mon, 10. Dec 18, 14:21
AdrianB1 wrote:
Mon, 10. Dec 18, 13:24
palm911 wrote:
Sun, 9. Dec 18, 02:34
people spend more at any mid level restaurant... i thiunk its fairly priced., and will grow, it also means egosoft will ahve the resources to keep expanding, so i am in full agrement with their model!
Please go to your preferred restaurant, tell them to give you something that is a foundation for a meal, not completely cooked, with missing ingredients, with strange taste and come back and tell you are happy with this because they will complete the meal next week and they will get better and better, so in one year time they will get a Michelin star. But pay the full price for this first meal and eat it now, appreciate the potential in it and dream of what the future will be.

Post some pictures or a video after you do it.
if you dislike it so much, what are you doing here? you should know how launches has ever been with egosoft, you can decide to support them or not. i can understand people concerns about a developer some people has never heard of, but people who has know how egosoft support their tittle should have some peace of mind. .. just saying
if you like it so much, what are you doing here? why not you just play it instead of telling everybody to go away? honestly, nobody cares if you can accept their unethical ways of dealing with it, they are still unethical... (or are you here because the game in fact is dead and even the forum is more interesting than playing X4?)

CaptainX4
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Re: Honest Review from Steam. Developers Please Read!!

Post by CaptainX4 » Mon, 10. Dec 18, 14:40

Kane Hart wrote:
Mon, 10. Dec 18, 08:24
gschultz wrote:
Mon, 10. Dec 18, 07:33
Kane Hart wrote:
Mon, 10. Dec 18, 07:27
Sorry mate this is silly. Seems like you need a personal back rub or something. I'm going wait till the devs get off their weekend and keep pumping updates. They clearly can read the forums they will attempt to put more work into it. Might not be perfect as fixing economy simulated at this level is very complex.

Wish you luck on your back rub.
lol and when they read the forums they will see that people are asking for more communication, and decide whether they can multitask fixing their game AND *GASP* communicating in a central and highlighted way about broken core mechanics. i say and think everything you have. that doesn't mean that we have to shut our eyes. its a bit annoying that you are then pretending like i need a rub. childlish. if you can't see that then i dont know what to say to you. people love getting taken advantage of or treated poorly when they offer their support - they must uphold the contract to the customer, just like i do to mine. and you do to yours. thats why people watch. because you give them what they want and what is advertised. x4
See this what I don't understand contracts, etc. If you have legal issues you should be speaking to a lawyer and not on the official forums if they broken some sort of legal contract in their country. I'm happy with what the devs keeping doing and as long they keep working then their making easily one my fav games of all time. I'm sorry you don't see their hard work via their actions and need them to talk rather then work.

I will always take actions over words.
I see you like sitting in the dark, I wish you luck on your sitting in the dark :D :D :D
its so funny reading how you took this a personal quest telling everybody who ever dares to complain that you like how it works and you are happy to wait :D Keep waiting, its up to you but repeating this like a machine...

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Re: Honest Review from Steam. Developers Please Read!!

Post by CBJ » Mon, 10. Dec 18, 14:45

Why is it that every time this subject comes up, people feel the need to get personal about it? People are entitled to their opinions on both sides of the argument, and they are entitled to post those opinions. Everyone needs to stop telling others what they can and cannot post; the only people who are entitled to do that are moderators, when applying the forum rules and maintaining the peace.

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Re: Honest Review from Steam. Developers Please Read!!

Post by palm911 » Mon, 10. Dec 18, 15:10

CaptainX4 wrote:
Mon, 10. Dec 18, 14:35
palm911 wrote:
Mon, 10. Dec 18, 14:21
AdrianB1 wrote:
Mon, 10. Dec 18, 13:24

Please go to your preferred restaurant, tell them to give you something that is a foundation for a meal, not completely cooked, with missing ingredients, with strange taste and come back and tell you are happy with this because they will complete the meal next week and they will get better and better, so in one year time they will get a Michelin star. But pay the full price for this first meal and eat it now, appreciate the potential in it and dream of what the future will be.

Post some pictures or a video after you do it.
if you dislike it so much, what are you doing here? you should know how launches has ever been with egosoft, you can decide to support them or not. i can understand people concerns about a developer some people has never heard of, but people who has know how egosoft support their tittle should have some peace of mind. .. just saying
if you like it so much, what are you doing here? why not you just play it instead of telling everybody to go away? honestly, nobody cares if you can accept their unethical ways of dealing with it, they are still unethical... (or are you here because the game in fact is dead and even the forum is more interesting than playing X4?)
i am not telling "everybody" or "anybody" to go away, i simply asked a question to a very specific user based on what i understood was his/her feeling about the current state of the game, please you really need to stop quoting (or pretending to quote) things i have never said. and it seems you do care if i accept it or not captainX4, otherwise you wouldn't be responding to me regarding that issue? arent you?. thanks for caring :) :)

EGOSOFT, i congratulate you for your strongest launch of an X game ever. and i look forward for your DLCs! .
X gamer , one at a time.

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Re: Honest Review from Steam. Developers Please Read!!

Post by Ornias » Mon, 10. Dec 18, 15:21

I Numbered your complaints for easy responding in below quote:
DeJuan wrote:
Sun, 9. Dec 18, 00:49
The Bad:

1. Massive amounts of bugs in almost every area of the game.
2. Extremely small map compared to X3 TC and X Rebirth.
3. Ship variety is lacking in a big way with all factions.
4. Not many factions which makes the game seem small.
5. No real enemies to fight and makes the game really boring.
6. Lack of story line. It is literally just a small sandbox with no clear direction.
7. Events do not really happen at all. Never been attacked by pirates or anything for that matter.
8. Lots of Races and Factions are missing altogether. Example: Boron
9. AI is really really dumb and has no clear purpose in some situations.
10. Weapons do not work properly and capitol ship shields are weak.
11. The ship upgrades are cookie cutter. Upgrades are bland and can found everywhere at the exact same prices.
12. Way to many inactive jump gates.
13. The UI is missing lots of commands such as making turrents stop firing so your marines can board and not get blown up. Or maybe I just did not see that setting.
1. A massive game from a relatively small team is bound to have at least a ton of QOL bugs (such as NPC-movement, strange behavior with good transfer and so on), those are excusable and usual. What is not however, is the current (lack-of)war/AI-shipbuilding bug. That one SHOULDNT be there.
2. It seems you haven't played it much (below 10 hours), the maps are about 5-10 times larger than in X3AP, Its about 25%-45% of the total X3AP "map area" (not taking into account maps had unlimited borders). Ships however are resized and are about 50% as big and travel speeds are about the same as with SETA in AP. If you call it an "extremely" small map, you definitely are misinformed. But lets say you have played enough, please list me all datavaults, if the map is that small, you already found all of them right?
3. Currently there are 70+ ships in the game, each of which has 2 versions (Source: https://roguey.co.uk/x4/ships/ ), not all ship and part difference are listed ingame however.... its looks like Paranid is superior on all fronts, but there are quite some unlisted drawbacks. In terms of cargo capacity vs speed for traders there is a lot of choice too, although it would be nice to have some weapon lockout on different freighters and having a dedicated TP (which doesnt exist), all in all the per-race amount of ships is the same as X3:TC (v1) but lower than X3:AP.
4. Not taking into account Xenon and Khaak, there are 3 main factions, 2 "Big" subfactions and 3 mini factions. indeed there are less factions than in X3:AP, but they are way more unique than X:Stillbirth.
5. That is a known bug and should be worked out.
6. The X series always where a Lore-grounded sandbox in the first place and the storylines came second. That being said, I agree with you that the current total lack of any significant storyline sucks. I want X3:AP level of storydevelopment.
7. You surely never played more than 10 hours.
8. Actually, they just started the story to reintroduce the Boron and split. I completely understand why they went ahead without boron an split. Its takes development time and lore-wise the boron and split where still disconnected from the rest of the gatenetwork when X:Stillbirth finished afaik. That is an Amazing opportunity to reintroduce them and write stories for it. I'm glad they didn't cheese them into the game without story just to please some reviewers.
9. I personally find the trading AI a huge upgrade from X3:AP, I cant say anything about the combat AI though. I don't get what you mean with "purpose", if you mean that you are amazed by the floating clusters of ships near some gates doing nothing, that is due to afore mentioned bug that prevents the war from continuing.
10. You should EXPLAIN why weapons do not work, they work for me. Although I dislike the more realistic gimbal reactiontime :P. Capital ship shields are indeed a bit on the weak side, although I find it a bit weird to nitpick on some small QOL balancing issue you couldn't realistically have encountered in any serieus form yet.
11. Cookie cutter? You know there are 80+ different types of engines with different specifications? :P Thats only the engines. I agree that the stat difference should be a bit bigger but thats about it. The pricing didn't annoy me, but should indeed be linked to the resource prices instead of just a hardcoded price. Thats a serieus QOL issue that should be fixed. It might be related to why they postponed the player shipyard...
12. Did you actually understand any of the lore? Those where in use once and after the disconnect they are still there, waiting to be reconnected to the network. To many to be ever used in DLC? Yes I think so, but it's a nice easter egg to reflect the history of the X universe and whats to come.
13. If you fly yourself, its a bar on the top of the HUD. Although that seems to be broken with capitalships, its there with M size. That sounds like you cheesed yourself a capital and started complaining.

DeJuan wrote:
Sun, 9. Dec 18, 00:49
Conclusion:
The game has great bones and I know Egosoft will fix most of the problems but to charge $50 for a game in this state in not really fair to the buyer. After 28 hours of playing I got bored. I played X3 for thousands of hours. The major problem with the game is that it is generic with no variety of ships, events, sectors, races/factions, wars, upgrades. The AI is just useless and the game is not really fun because of all the things that are GONE. The first few expansions should be free for anyone who pre ordered the game in this state. At best X4 should have had everything from X3 TC with some of the things from X Rebirth.
Starting a conclussion with a semi-offensive statement isn't really the way to go. "Your mom has great bones", suggest she is ugly as ****.
Even in this state, the amount of content is insanely huge for a niche game. Niche games of this scale tend to be on the more expensive side... It's a bit too much, yeah... but it's not that big of a deal. Its still WAY cheaper than buying one movie per hour.
I don't believe you there, there is SO MUCH to explore and so many hidden gems... Just my datavault hunt (which is about halfway through), WITH the use of spoilers, is already 3-5 hours(!)... I haven't even finished building my first end-product complex, haven't claimed a sector and just got my first destroyer. Bet you didnt even know there was a hidden claimable destroyer somewhere.

The Major problem is you wanting to get every bit of content on a silver plater, thats not X and never was X to begin with. There are no things "gone", there are things that aren't in THIS game. Its a new game, without content updates...
"At best X4 should have had everything from X3 TC", thats retarded... you are saying that you expected a DECADE of game developement to be redone (because X4 Foundations is a complete rewrite and doesn't use much original content) and sold for just 50$. That sounds to me like egoism more than a review.

"Honest Review from Steam"
This title is perfect, because it perfectly describes the shortsighted attitude of Steam reviews. This isnt a product for the masses and never will be.

That being said:
Are there bugs: Yes
Are there QOL tweaks needed? Yes
Is there promised content missing? Yes

Those are the things that should be fixed, because Egosoft should deliver what they promise.
But they never promised most of the things this reviewer complains about.

Comparing a game after YEARS and YEARS of support and content updates (X3, hell even X:R), with a new product and demanding content the developers openly told you wouldn't be in here, IS NOT FAIR nor reasonable. It doesn't give anyone motivation to actually discuss the real problems with you, because they know you will start complaining about content you want to be in it, which wouldn't be in this game to begin with.

Socratatus
Posts: 1551
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Re: Honest Review from Steam. Developers Please Read!!

Post by Socratatus » Mon, 10. Dec 18, 15:26

Yawn...

In my 20 years of being a member of various games forums almost nothing`s changed. Silly arguments still continue even while the game is clearly being patched and fixed on almost a DAILY basis. Nobody wants to wait, everyone wants to complain at the Devs.

Only change is people have weaker backbones and feel `offended` even quicker than ever before.
1. Please do more on NPC civilian/uniform variety, and bio customisations, Devs.
2. Stations need sirens when enemy is close in numbers.
Yes, for immersion. Thankyou ahead of time.

"No problem can withstand the assault of sustained thinking."

palm911
Posts: 1140
Joined: Sun, 29. Jul 07, 22:52
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Re: Honest Review from Steam. Developers Please Read!!

Post by palm911 » Mon, 10. Dec 18, 15:31

thank you @Ornias for such a detailed response i couldnt agree more!

EDIT i meant ornias not dejuan.
Last edited by palm911 on Mon, 10. Dec 18, 17:34, edited 1 time in total.
X gamer , one at a time.

Ornias
Posts: 41
Joined: Fri, 7. Dec 18, 07:04
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Re: Honest Review from Steam. Developers Please Read!!

Post by Ornias » Mon, 10. Dec 18, 16:44

gschultz wrote:
Mon, 10. Dec 18, 06:52
- even if egosoft works this way that means nothing. ive been a customer since x2 and bought everything...even xrebirth vr. this doesn't make me any more than others.....im just saying this you know that i know egosoft. saying that we know they release full priced games that are not finished or broken is really not an argument we should be repeating. i get it, but please it proves nothing really but that we are being normalized. they could have made it a beta. they could have been upfront that core mechanics were turned off or not working. ya see?

- the game is being updated, yes. 1.3 didnt fix the core issues. how about they at least ADMIT to the problems and say we have priority on this and that. not say "you want more war"? which implies that these are design decisions. if these are design decisions and not broken mechnics please save us time and just tell us.

- i bout all xrebirth and dlc and vr offering. what more can i do? how much more can i support? should i keep buying unfinished games without this being explicit and just be happy? you dont see the slipperly slope? lawyers are circling this industry, for good reason. im not saying egosoft deserves it. im saying they need to step up communication to their customers and not leave it up to all of us idiots trying to figure stuff out in the forums. instead of telling noobs about complex mechanics, we are fighting to understand what the heck we are playing.

also thanks for the videos. its always good to have some content to watch in downtime, about one of your favorite IPs. but lets hold them to standards - ethical standards. our standards.
- What core mechanics? The only one I know is the fact war is broken, I HIGHLY doubt they knew at launch, nothing point to them knewing it was broken. Only missing feature is player shipyards, although I'm not sure they even promised that.

- If CTD's are not "Core issues", what are they? It sounds to me that you only call your personal issues "core issues". Be fair: THey fixed a lot of game breaking bugs and CTD issues, on top of that they fixed a few "One line in code" bugs. The statement "You want more war" was the only time they responded and it was before we all figured out the shipyards where broken... You want them to communicate more, yet you attack them on responding not knowing the issue.

- You don't have to support, you support because you want to. Btw, this is a new game so your support for previous games is not really relevant.
I, for example, didnt buy stillbirth. I read up on what was in it, what was not and the design decisions. Waited the first reviews and skipped it. Skipped it still because what was important FOR ME, was not in that game.
I, yet again for example, bought this game. I read up on what was in it, what was not and yet again the design decisions. Waited the first reviews and hit order on Steam. Because for ME this game gives me the essence of what I want.
Am I disappointed? Besides the consequences of the war/ shipyard bug, they delivered what they promised. So no, I am not disappointed.

"you dont see the slipperly slope"
Actually, this game was less troublesome at release than their previous offerings. So if you mean the slippery slope goes upwards, yes I see it. Great isn't it?

"lawyers are circling this industry, for good reason"
We don't all live in Murica. Here in Europe you need to give a supplier or shop a reasonable timeframe to fix any significant issues.
As a jurist, although consumer law is not my specialization, I can assure you the only issues currently known that MAY qualify for reimbursement is the war/shipyard issue. The timeframe for them to fix it, is somewhere between 2 weeks and 3 months. So there is no realistic prospect lawyers are getting involved (yet). All the other QOL issues are not really relevant, unless they promissed a said QOL feature would (or wouldn't) be in the product.

" im saying they need to step up communication to their customers"
- Yet the previous time they did, they now get attacked for by you, because they misunderstood a certain issue.

"we are fighting to understand what the heck we are playing. "
- Can you point me at that post? I missed that one. Even the average joe/steam-reviewer got what they where playing, although they didn't get HOW they should be playing it due to the serieusly screwed-up tutorials.

Ornias
Posts: 41
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Re: Honest Review from Steam. Developers Please Read!!

Post by Ornias » Mon, 10. Dec 18, 16:49

Socratatus wrote:
Mon, 10. Dec 18, 15:26
Yawn...

In my 20 years of being a member of various games forums almost nothing`s changed. Silly arguments still continue even while the game is clearly being patched and fixed on almost a DAILY basis. Nobody wants to wait, everyone wants to complain at the Devs.

Only change is people have weaker backbones and feel `offended` even quicker than ever before.
Indeed thats precisely the point:
People "want" things.
Most what I read here, silly or not, is about features that ES was quite clear "would not be in the game at launch" or QOL issues. People want more races, want more industrial ships (or less industrial, or just different, or more polygons)...
What happened with reading up on the damn thing you are buying these days?!

Well be glad that the developers are not that easily offended... Otherwise I would expect some flying pink dongs with names of certain "reviewers" and "Users" on them. ;)

XD733
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue, 2. Oct 18, 14:37

Re: Honest Review from Steam. Developers Please Read!!

Post by XD733 » Mon, 10. Dec 18, 17:18

Thanks for the review. It's really disappointing that the devs seem not to have learned anything from the launch of X:Rebirth. I was really hoping that they would reverse the downward slide but it doesn't seem so.

I still plan to buy X4 if they ever patch it to playability.

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